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Phil@Watford
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeMon 21 Dec - 20:33

the only sugestion i can think of... is that keep all the major teams protected until a manager can be found, that would be all the teams in the premier league and probs Pompy as they seem to be one ot the better teams in the lower leagues, and Shef utd, so that there isnt a slaughter for Carlton Cole.


apart from that... go hand Flyers out for people to join Hemsoft?
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeMon 21 Dec - 21:05

In an ideal world i agree completely with you.

i would much rather see the game full to the brim with more forum managers for us to pit our wits against but i dont think that will happen,
A) advertising doesnt seem to be high on the agenda or it would have happend by now.
B) i think you touched on this previously, pauls workload, i think has to be controlled, maybe wrong.

If the clubs all remain protected and inactive then we will continue to be disgruntled by the stagnated transfer market and more importantly the out dated teams we come up against week in week out that will grow more and more out dated as players grow their players grow even older.

i feel like were going in circles here
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Phil@Watford
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeMon 21 Dec - 21:10

i believe paul should come on this forum and read this topic.. take all the ideas on board... and let us know his opinion as he has say over it all anyways, i think his input would be a great help.
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Tom
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeMon 21 Dec - 21:23

Will@Fulham wrote:
I can assure you none of the nottingham branch complained of green pen.

so what are u proposing?

how would you like to see the game advance?

i dont think any one person can be singled out for necessarily complaining about green pen marks. people did used to "take the piss" and joke about green pens. others made continual rants about individual fake managers (like the napoli one) and also a lot of us kept using inverted speach marks when talking about certain "managed" clubs. i guess it only takes paul to read a few things and then continually read a few things before he got tired of what he felt was abuse to decide to split the game or whatever.

so...between everyone we've made our bed and now we have to live in it. hopefully there can be a solution...im in favour of anything that keeps the other teams comeptitve, makes it a bit tougher to sign a good player but also we need the market to remain active...but not so active as will correctly points out that there are wholesale changes at unmanaged clubs every week
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeMon 21 Dec - 21:26

Martin@Lazio wrote:
Going back to the proposals put by Rich, some are highly valid.

SWAP DEALS WITH PROTECTED / FAKE MANAGED CLUBS

How about:

Swapping a player from your club results in you also having to pay 75% of the buycost of your targeted player along with a mandatory signing on fee of X5 of the weekly wage of your current player that you are swapping out, this along with the cost of the player you are swapping out upto 94 level, after that if you want to swap in a player rated at 95 it should be at + 100% buycost, 97 + 125% the buycost and at 99 + 200% the buycost.

The buycost of any player swapped in will be reduced by 50% and will not raise above that unless the player has been at your club for 2 full seasons (48 turns) for swap purposes, no matter how he progresses in real life.

No player over the age of 33 to be swapped out.

The real life scenario is unjustifiable as with the 2 transfer windows players in real life are prone to moving on and you should not be penalised for capturing a real life player who may well move on within a few months.

this isnt a bad shout. I have had to employ an interpretor ro understand it...but if you can dig through the premise..it's not a bad alternative
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeMon 21 Dec - 21:50

Stuart@Roma wrote:
im in favour of anything that keeps the other teams comeptitve, makes it a bit tougher to sign a good player but also we need the market to remain active...but not so active as will correctly points out that there are wholesale changes at unmanaged clubs every week


nailed on stu.

thats exactly what my thoughts and suggestions are trying to get,

its gonna be hard to get, but we just need to find that happy medium that suits all.
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeMon 21 Dec - 21:53

Rich@Leicester wrote:
Phil@Arsenal wrote:


i also refuse to pay x3 a players value.. + a player for a player, and i rich refuses to settle with x2.....

this is exactly the point Phil. If a limit is set high enough that makes you think...I'm not paying that... then its the right one isnt it????

you shouldnt be able to pick off talent at will to sit in your reserves and sell chuffin hot-dogs!. To buy from a 'protected/real-fake" you're going to have to REALLY want the player if that PROSWAP (Trademarked, available for sale to hemsoft for 1 x seasonticket season 2010-2011) system is brought in.

Please can I make this clear. I am not proposing scrapping SWAPBID...

completely agree with this.

would allow swapbidding to happen but because of excalated prices would keep it to a sensible level and if anything continue to push us towards dealing with each other.

there would be the optio to go out there and break the bank for an fake managers prize talent but it would mean it wont be a cheaper alternative.
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Tom@Charlton
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeMon 21 Dec - 21:55

Rich@Leicester wrote:

The alternative to this is the 'as you were' system. Open bidding to be at least 2 x buycost...but..get the AI to search for the same type of player with the same PTCR the second that player is lost. THIS CANNOT BE LIMITED TO BUYING REPLACEMENT FROM THE TRANSFER LIST!!!

Completely agree with this. A new structured openbidding system.

Don't agree with PROSWAP whatsoever though. How can rival managers build strong succesful teams when any of us can just take their players at any time? Again, will make the game too easy and I don't want to see it.
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeMon 21 Dec - 22:32

Tis the reason i do 99% of my dealings through either a fellow 'Forumer', NEW or Trial......makes my life far easier lol!

i dont think i've ever swapped a player Neutral

hows about a limit on the CR you can actually go for with regards to swaps? Say CR 95? this would in theory mean that clubs keep their best players and can develop TU?
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeMon 21 Dec - 22:36

Tom@Charlton-Bayern wrote:
Just a thought but the only way a swapping system could work, in my eyes, with a fake managed club is that the fake manager should have the final say.

So you can put an offer of a swap in, like the ones Rich suggests, but it might not be accepted if the manager feels he can't do without that player. Final decision should go to the manager in possesion.

Rather than PROSWAP or any equivilant, I suppose what I would like is an adjustment in the current OPENBID system.

The system exists currently where you can put any type of offer in, money, player, money+player etc., but the way it disappoints to me is that you are forever waiting for the deal to go through if it ever does. My suggestion is, if Paul can implement it, that the real/fake managers think about your offer and then come back to you, with either an acceptance, a counter offer, a refusal or just any kind of feedback on your offer. For example, they might want more money, a player in exchange, a better player than you have offered, or just not want to let the player go whatever the price if he is a favourite of that manager.

Basically just how we do things on here.

Wouldn't it be better to have to barter with these managers than have set guidelines that all managers must live by.

Weren't we saying how good it would be if certain fake managers brought their own traits with them?

Thats the best option of the lot for me!!

Ive sent paul a copy of this link, asking him to have a little look and to comment with any thoughts of his own.

For me if the AI is capable of doing this then this is the best answer and could really make the game very interesting indeed.
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Jamie@Watford
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeMon 21 Dec - 22:42

Will@Fulham wrote:
Tom@Charlton-Bayern wrote:
Just a thought but the only way a swapping system could work, in my eyes, with a fake managed club is that the fake manager should have the final say.

So you can put an offer of a swap in, like the ones Rich suggests, but it might not be accepted if the manager feels he can't do without that player. Final decision should go to the manager in possesion.

Rather than PROSWAP or any equivilant, I suppose what I would like is an adjustment in the current OPENBID system.

The system exists currently where you can put any type of offer in, money, player, money+player etc., but the way it disappoints to me is that you are forever waiting for the deal to go through if it ever does. My suggestion is, if Paul can implement it, that the real/fake managers think about your offer and then come back to you, with either an acceptance, a counter offer, a refusal or just any kind of feedback on your offer. For example, they might want more money, a player in exchange, a better player than you have offered, or just not want to let the player go whatever the price if he is a favourite of that manager.

Basically just how we do things on here.

Wouldn't it be better to have to barter with these managers than have set guidelines that all managers must live by.

Weren't we saying how good it would be if certain fake managers brought their own traits with them?

Thats the best option of the lot for me!!

Ive sent paul a copy of this link, asking him to have a little look and to comment with any thoughts of his own.

For me if the AI is capable of doing this then this is the best answer and could really make the game very interesting indeed.

The only problem with this is that it could take forever to conclude a deal and use up so many dealings! Could prove very frustrating!
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeMon 21 Dec - 22:43

is that not the marvellous world of football management ?
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Jamie@Watford
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeMon 21 Dec - 22:45

But in real football management you are able to contact each other more regularly than once a fortnight!
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Tom@Charlton
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeMon 21 Dec - 22:47

Jamie@Watford wrote:

The only problem with this is that it could take forever to conclude a deal and use up so many dealings! Could prove very frustrating!

Surely would take less time than the current OPENBID system though?

I had to wait weeks and weeks for three to be accepted, with the most frustrating thing being the lack of feedback. I assumed the bids weren't big enough, but they went through eventually after about 12 weeks?

Wouldn't take this long surely?
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeMon 21 Dec - 22:50

bloody hell ja!!lol!!

it aint going to be perfect, but its by far the best and most sensible option been put forward.

he wants bood i tell u, blood.

good hair today by the way,very funky thought id mention it.lol
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeMon 21 Dec - 22:50

I Like Tom's idea alot. Would be much like when i 1st started playing the game way back when! If it was not possible to get in contact with a certain manager then you had to write them a note and wait for a reply then write another note etc...... This would be like that but alot quicker if you got the feedback the next turn.
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Jamie@Watford
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeMon 21 Dec - 22:57

Tom@Charlton-Bayern wrote:
Jamie@Watford wrote:

The only problem with this is that it could take forever to conclude a deal and use up so many dealings! Could prove very frustrating!

Surely would take less time than the current OPENBID system though?

I had to wait weeks and weeks for three to be accepted, with the most frustrating thing being the lack of feedback. I assumed the bids weren't big enough, but they went through eventually after about 12 weeks?

Wouldn't take this long surely?

I agree Tom, the Openbid system needs reviewing.

I like your idea about only being able to get players from protected/fake manager clubs by using the open bid system.

But think it needs to be much more clear - say 3x the transfer value, therefore you must really really want them.

So if you put a bid of 12million in for Carlton Cole, you get him the following turn, no waiting around. If 2 or more clubs put in an offer it goes with the current priorities which are already inplace. So if you want to throw even more cash to get the player, just to be safe, rather than a bigger transfer fee, you do a big sign on fee, like how it already happens.

Then the fake manager uses his transfer fee collected to improve the side how he sees fit.

Fake managers for all protected clubs - then carry on as normal.

All players are available, just those at protected clubs, you have to pay a fortune, which will put a lot of people off, therefore not wrecking TU. But if you really want some1 you still have that option!
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Jamie@Watford
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeMon 21 Dec - 22:58

Will@Fulham wrote:
bloody hell ja!!lol!!

it aint going to be perfect, but its by far the best and most sensible option been put forward.

he wants bood i tell u, blood.

good hair today by the way,very funky thought id mention it.lol

Wasnt intentional mate - Ive never been funky in my life!!
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Tom
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeTue 22 Dec - 15:08

Rich@ManUtd wrote:
I Like Tom's idea alot. Would be much like when i 1st started playing the game way back when! If it was not possible to get in contact with a certain manager then you had to write them a note and wait for a reply then write another note etc...... This would be like that but alot quicker if you got the feedback the next turn.

seconded.

and i would also like to add that rich's original idea around swaps is very good. it was interesting actually reading through all this just now and seeing Phil's comment their of "i'm not paying that!" regards the 3x TV plus swap idea. as rich points out, if you are left thinking that then it has to be the right thing. also tom was spot on earlier with this:


Tom@Charlton-Bayern wrote:
Personally I do think all current protected clubs need fake managers (yes, even clubs like Pompey in League 2) and swapbidding shouldn't be allowed at all with protected/fake managed clubs.

We would just end up with the reverse problem we have at the minute. All these teams would have very low team understanding due to a lot of changes and as a result not be as competitive.

Sorry, but would be very disappointed if any of these were implemented. A lot of my enjoyment is finding bargains, or underrated players at unmanaged clubs and going against other managers for players (Jamie@Watford a lot of the time, strangely!). This would be taken out completely as all managers would have the option to go after your Carlton Coles, Yossi Benayouns, Albert Rieras etc...

Basically there aren't enough forum managers in our game now for the pool of players to be saturated. Meaning there will always be players available if you don't get your number one target. Basically would make the game a lot easier, and the top flight will eventually end up with all the forum managers being in the top flight and all the other leagues becoming uninteresting and useless.

Personally like the restrictions in England, and we if we open up all clubs to swapbidding it will make it far too easy to build a decent squad and deals between forum managers would become a thing of the past.

Foreign clubs in the game have free reign on players all round the world, which in my eyes makes playing the game a lot easier as you can always find a player to fill a gap, whether you have heard of him or not. Just look in the Brazilian leagues for any position needed...
As a result, is it a coincidence that the German, Spanish and Italian leagues are dominated by forum managed clubs? Top2 in Germany, top 2 in Spain, top 5 in Italy?

Anyway, happy with how it was before, but now why can't we just have 'real fake' managers instead of Linda, Ray, Geoff etc..? but more active in the market.

you should only be able to openbid for what we should call "managed protected" clubs. and those offers should, in reality only be accepted at either 1. the clubs discretion on how valuable he is to the team (a good thing for me would be if paul could utilise better something like the "star" system that he has for national sides to desipher this or indeed if he is in the national team in the game) and 2. if the offer is pretty outlandish. their could be a structure for this:-

9999 - 50-80 million
9797 - 25-30 million
9795 - 20-25 million
9595 - 15-20 million
9794 - 15-20 million
9594 - 12-15 million
9494 - 12-15 million

though all offers would of course ultimately be decided by the 'managed protected' club and if they felt the value of the player is higher then they reserve the right to refuse, especially if the player is in the national team for his country. in which case the valuation is higher.
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeTue 22 Dec - 15:32

I don't think it should matter how long it takes you to land the player (if at all).

Chelsea chased Essien for how long?.. 6months? Longer?

However, during those negotiations...I highly doubt Mourinho or Kenyon just left lots of voicemail messages on Lyons club answerphone, didn't know what was happening, then come august Essien turns up at Chelsea training, saying 'hi, my names Michael'

all we need back on open bids is some communication, and AI for that realfake manager to go and spend his dough wisely and not just buy shit from the transfer list
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeTue 22 Dec - 15:48

rich or will....rather than forward the link of this topic to paul i think the best thing is if one of you guys could instead "cherry pick" the best points of this discussion (if you have time). it'll save paul having to trawl through all the 99 postings we've made thus far! i'd do it myself but incredibly busy in the chritmas run up, workin 12 hours again tonight....eurghhhh..

cheers lads and for everyone's participation in this thread

Stuart
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeTue 22 Dec - 16:43

i would like a bullet point breakdown cos i aint reading all that rubbish
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeTue 22 Dec - 16:48

if somebody pm's me a bullet point breakdown of all the re-structural ideas then i can make an annoucement post which will be easier and save trawling.
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeTue 22 Dec - 19:03

This thread scares me!!! lol
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Phil@Watford
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeTue 22 Dec - 19:37

does the fact i openswapped Kalou for Carlton Cole scrare you more?
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PostSubject: Re: Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs   Suggestions for Transfers from/to Protected Clubs - Page 3 Icon_minitimeTue 22 Dec - 19:49

If I knew what any of this meant 'openswapped??' then it just might. lol

So is an openbid from me for Carlton Cole pointless if changes are going to happen, and openbids take so long to go thru if succesful?
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