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Iain@RealMadrid
Rob@Barcelona
Ben@Plymouth
Tom@Charlton
Paul Hemmings
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 13:09

The same as the ones I do in friendlies which I always win. So bollocks to it.
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Phil@Watford
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 13:15

We'll that is extremely disappointing to lose to Everton at home. Will have to digest the turn when I get it. I'm still top but only just! I suppose a draw in Europe isn't the worst result just depends how the other two games go Smile

Very happy in France with Lille getting another win

A huge amount of sendings off this week. Will be interesting to see how teams bounce back next week. The premier league is extremely close will be interesting to see who falls from grace at the end.
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Ben@Plymouth
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 13:17

Will@Fulham wrote:
Rich (brum)

What happend ? What tactics did u play ?

I'm at a total loss on this. This is what makes this game so amazing, I play the same tactics and on hand scrape a win and on the other score 8! A testament to you Paul entirely that the game can mirror the variations in real life!
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Ben@Plymouth
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 13:22

Paul Hemmings wrote:


There is only one AI and it runs all the games using the same set of rules.

I thought this was the case - as I said testament to you Paul for how changes in opposition and tactics can make the world of difference!
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Tom@Charlton
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 13:24

In the end a great week for me, 3 wins and a draw at Inter.

Not sure I fancy a trip away to Plymouth next week though...



Hats off to Rich though, to be 5 points clear of Barca and 2 clear of Real is a mighty achievement.
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 13:27

Couldn't be happier. Not sure what Betis did in Europe, but sounds like a 0-0.

I started this season thinking that a distant third to Iain and Matt would be an achievement, now I think there's a chance Betis could be a close third!
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 13:28

Oh and Leicester won twice too...
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Paul Hemmings
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 13:44

Since I extended the length of the pitch to simulate the areas just in front of the defence and just behind the strikers there is one thing I have noticed quite markedly.

If I play two equally matched sides, team A and team B, the game plays out quite evenly and the score may end up in a draw, say 1-1 or a narrow win for one or the other. But if I then replace one of the centrebacks in team A with an inferior player or one who is lacking in skills, instead of the score ending up 1-1 it ends up 3-1 or 4-1 to team B. That one player can now make quite a difference.

This didnt happen on the shorter pitch.

It means that your squad is now an essential part of your club, whereas it has traditionally in CF been the first 11 it is now the first 18 cos you need good cover everywhere esp in defence, and if you lose a defender in the game you need to ensure your game mods and subs are setup to slot another decent defender into his place.



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Paul Hemmings
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 13:51

Birmingham got hammered this week playing without any fullbacks or wingbacks against Wayne Rooney and he is clever enough to take full advantage of this fact esp as he has Robinho in front of him that he can feed into the spaces.

Against some teams this system can work very well if the players in the other team arent clever enough to exploit the spaces or their players arent quick enough to exploit the spaces. So if you play without backs of any sort make sure your anchormen are quick enough to get across to fillin when needed. This didnt happen for Birmingham against Plymouth.

I'm not sure why it was working so well in friendlies as you should have found that against some players it shouldn't have worked, I'll check that out.
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Paul Hemmings
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 13:54

Ive finished the transfers and the only deal that didn't go through was the Guiseppe Rossi one as he wouldn't go back to playing for Rob as he had already been at Inter ( I assume under Rob ). All other manager deals went through.

I am now going to run all the bids incl swapbids and permbids.
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 13:57

Is it anything to do with Rich at Brum seemingly changing tactics regularly? I'm only an outside observer obviously..

Didn't Mark get absolutely shat on by someone last year when he played with no full backs whatsoever?
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Iain@RealMadrid
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 14:20

Steady week, bit disappointed with the draw in Europe but an away point is ok, Betis are on fire in Spain and now are strong title contenders
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Paul Hemmings
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 14:22

Rich@Leicester wrote:
Is it anything to do with Rich at Brum seemingly changing tactics regularly? I'm only an outside observer obviously..

Didn't Mark get absolutely shat on by someone last year when he played with no full backs whatsoever?

I cant think of any teams that have played without some sort of fullbacks and had success ? can anybody ?
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Rob@Barcelona
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 14:27

Win away at Milan was better than expected and a draw after having Khedira sent off in Europe is no disgrace. Defence doing well with 2 clean sheets.

Boca .... looking strong. Shame about Rossi as I'm really unsure about Farfan as a striker. Need another option to support the ever reliable Fernandez and Damiao.
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Ben@Plymouth
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 14:46

Paul Hemmings wrote:
Rich@Leicester wrote:
Is it anything to do with Rich at Brum seemingly changing tactics regularly? I'm only an outside observer obviously..

Didn't Mark get absolutely shat on by someone last year when he played with no full backs whatsoever?

I cant think of any teams that have played without some sort of fullbacks and had success ? can anybody ?

Barca in real life have often done it and 3 at the back is becoming more common

and(http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/blog/2011/dec/13/the-question-3-1-4-2-formation-rise)

But in Barca's case the back 3 are supported by the AM who drops back when necessary to make a back 4...
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 14:52

Paul Hemmings wrote:
Rich@Leicester wrote:
Is it anything to do with Rich at Brum seemingly changing tactics regularly? I'm only an outside observer obviously..

Didn't Mark get absolutely shat on by someone last year when he played with no full backs whatsoever?

I cant think of any teams that have played without some sort of fullbacks and had success ? can anybody ?

I meant that Mark ended up with no fullbacks on the pitch. I think he made a change at half-time in the game,... and came out for the second half with no full backs, or wing-halves.. I remember the instance, I think he was winning at HT, then changed to no width at all, and got creamed in the second half.
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Paul Hemmings
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 15:30

Ben@Plymouth wrote:
Paul Hemmings wrote:
Rich@Leicester wrote:
Is it anything to do with Rich at Brum seemingly changing tactics regularly? I'm only an outside observer obviously..

Didn't Mark get absolutely shat on by someone last year when he played with no full backs whatsoever?

I cant think of any teams that have played without some sort of fullbacks and had success ? can anybody ?

Barca in real life have often done it and 3 at the back is becoming more common

and(http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/blog/2011/dec/13/the-question-3-1-4-2-formation-rise)

But in Barca's case the back 3 are supported by the AM who drops back when necessary to make a back 4...

I dont remember ever seeing Barca play without wingbacks against decent teams, although I can see how it might work against the poorer spanish sides they face week in week out. Can you remember the last time you saw it so I can search down some match footage to watch, see how it worked. thx
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Paul Hemmings
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 15:46

I cant find any footage of teams playing without backs of some sort.

At the moment you cant play without either fullbacks or wingbacks against decent teams. If you could then I would effectively be doing away with them in the game as nobody would bother with them.
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Paul Hemmings
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 15:46

going to run the training & finances now.
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Rob@Barcelona
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 15:47

I think one of the keys in this is the fact that when they do it as Ben says the holding midfielder is very deep. What I think is more interesting is the Chile formation of 3313 with 3 CB's, 3 narrow midfielders (1 very deep and 2 box to box) and then a TM, ST, LW, RW. Introduced by Bielsa and now played by his Bilbao team which did well in Europe a couple of seasons ago. Apparently a lot of Guardiola's thinking was based on his admiration of Bielsa. The idea is real total football defending from the front and playing midfielders at CB - Javi Martinez at Bilbao and Vidal or Medel for Chile, so they can play the ball from defence better. Do a search on 'Guardiola Bielsa' for more info. Think this is where the idea of Mascherano or Busquets playing CB came from.

Trying this in the game with Chile and to a lesser extent at Boca with a midfielder at CB and having success. Not managed to get to a back 3 ... yet.
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Ben@Plymouth
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 15:48

Paul Hemmings wrote:
Ben@Plymouth wrote:
Paul Hemmings wrote:
Rich@Leicester wrote:
Is it anything to do with Rich at Brum seemingly changing tactics regularly? I'm only an outside observer obviously..

Didn't Mark get absolutely shat on by someone last year when he played with no full backs whatsoever?

I cant think of any teams that have played without some sort of fullbacks and had success ? can anybody ?

Barca in real life have often done it and 3 at the back is becoming more common

and(http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/blog/2011/dec/13/the-question-3-1-4-2-formation-rise)

But in Barca's case the back 3 are supported by the AM who drops back when necessary to make a back 4...

I dont remember ever seeing Barca play without wingbacks against decent teams, although I can see how it might work against the poorer spanish sides they face week in week out. Can you remember the last time you saw it so I can search down some match footage to watch, see how it worked. thx

This seems to be a classic case Paul - http://www.zonalmarking.net/2011/08/29/barcelona-5-0-villarreal-tactics/

Whether these highlights help am not sure though - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyCT9FEhD2k
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Ben@Plymouth
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 15:48

Rob@Inter wrote:
I think one of the keys in this is the fact that when they do it as Ben says the holding midfielder is very deep. What I think is more interesting is the Chile formation of 3313 with 3 CB's, 3 narrow midfielders (1 very deep and 2 box to box) and then a TM, ST, LW, RW. Introduced by Bielsa and now played by his Bilbao team which did well in Europe a couple of seasons ago. Apparently a lot of Guardiola's thinking was based on his admiration of Bielsa. The idea is real total football defending from the front and playing midfielders at CB - Javi Martinez at Bilbao and Vidal or Medel for Chile, so they can play the ball from defence better. Do a search on 'Guardiola Bielsa' for more info. Think this is where the idea of Mascherano or Busquets playing CB came from.

Trying this in the game with Chile and to a lesser extent at Boca with a midfielder at CB and having success. Not managed to get to a back 3 ... yet.

On this Rob - http://www.zonalmarking.net/2010/06/08/marcelo-bielsa-chile-world-cup-2010-tactics/

Although Bielsa plays with AM who act more like traditional wing backs.
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Rob@Barcelona
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 15:59

Ben - not dissimilar to Chile or Bilbao.
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Rob@Barcelona
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 16:02

For me those 2 midfielders are more like super DY's as they do everything. The deep midfielder seems to sit and also swaps with Medel if Medel is bringing the ball out.
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Paul Hemmings
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 16:18

Ben@Plymouth wrote:


This seems to be a classic case Paul - http://www.zonalmarking.net/2011/08/29/barcelona-5-0-villarreal-tactics/



You can absolutely do this in the game as well as Villareal played without much width, with only Cani occasionally venturing out wide to make it 3 upfront. Villareal didnt play a target man either to exploit any space.
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Ben@Plymouth
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PostSubject: Re: Season 23 Week 8 processing...   Season 23 Week 8 processing... - Page 14 Icon_minitimeTue 29 Jan - 16:26

Paul Hemmings wrote:
Ben@Plymouth wrote:


This seems to be a classic case Paul - http://www.zonalmarking.net/2011/08/29/barcelona-5-0-villarreal-tactics/



You can absolutely do this in the game as well as Villareal played without much width, with only Cani occasionally venturing out wide to make it 3 upfront. Villareal didnt play a target man either to exploit any space.

Would be 3 CB - AM - DL - DR - TM - ST - LW - RW playing as FLY?
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